Die Präventivkriegsthese (German Edition)

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Der Tag M.

Actually Hitler's intentions were spelled in detail in his Mein Kampf so all the armchair historians with their revisionist histories mis-understand the nature of the Nazis - personally I believe that if France and England would not have fought in , they both would have become satellites of Germany in a way or another, while the coming Nazi-Soviet war winner would have dominated the whole continent since America would have found it hard to get involved in Europe with England hostile, or there would have been a stalemate and Cold War between the Reich's Europe and the USSR The USSR was a huge country and even if Moscow would have fallen - which may have meant the end of Stalin - I doubt Germany could have outright defeated it fast As it happens C.

Evans Omega has precisely this scenario - a bit of a different beginning, in so far Hitler dies in a plane accident and the military takes power while England and France ally with the military de-nazified Reich, take Moscow but still cannot defeat the USSR, while later there is a triple cold war between America, the Euro Union above and Russia Also H. And I agree, the British Empire needed to fall and colonialism needed to end. It's Peter's article which suggests that this is apparently a bad thing. Exactly why is left unexplained. For a few barmy weeks at the end of the British and French considered declaring war on Russia a technical ally of Germany at that point and aiding Finland, but they couldn't square that with Finland being a non-belligerent ally of Germany.

Us declaring war on Russia and Germany simultaneously would have been totally insane at that stage. As for the rest, yes. France was mentioned in Mein Kampf as needing to be pacified, so the invasion would have happened regardless, just maybe a bit later.

Hitler was scared of an Anglo-French invasion of Germany whilst they were busy in Poland, which could have been a good idea. Cutting off the Ruhr from the rest of Germany would have been disastrous for the German war machine. Unfortunately the Brits and French were too timid to go on the offensive. Whether that would have been as effective against a USSR armed with Ts and MiG fighters I'm not sure, but if it worked in it could have worked again.

Hitler, of course, wanted his quick-fix blitzkrieg on the eastern front, which was really not as effective in Russia as it was in France. Time travel alternate universes etc. His other stuff is good too. Dean Koontz did a time travelling Nazi in one of his books, can't remember off hand which one though. Star Trek had had an episode with Nazis in.

Return to castle Wolfenstein. The Twilight Zone. Now I think about it there is a lot out there. I do find reading books like Barbarossa to be more facinating than spec fiction. There are even people saying the whole genre of fantasy literature is a wartime spawned genre of the fight of good vs evil, usually citing Tolkien's Lord of the Rings as prime example.

I recently read Baxter's "Time Tapestry" series which went from the early Roman period in Britain to an alternate reality where Germany occupied half of southern Britain. It's an interesting idea and may be applicable to post-war fantasy, but for Tolkien it's pretty unsupported. Tolkien himself always said that, whilst loathing "That ruddy little ignoramus," Hitler, he always felt more pity than loathing for the German people and felt that the 'true' enemy was Russia whilst angrily denying Mordor being in the east was a reflection of that.

It's kind of hard to see how Tolkien's stuff could be taken any other way.

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Mordor in the East, the evil, dark skinned Southrons, the valiant men of the West and North I just tried to ignore that when I read it. And dark-skinned southrons really don't have anything to do with Russians. Adam: Two minor points: first, I think Chamberlain is treated very unfairly. We didn't just sit on our hands after Munich - we built the RAF! If you look at the British situation at that time, we were simply not ready to go to war with Germany - we were too demilitarised, our armour was far too sparse, and in particular our airforce was nowhere near what would be necessary to fight the Luftwaffe.

Munich wasn't 'timidity' - it was an admixture of genuine idealism Chamberlain remembered WWI, and at the time it was not impossible that Hitler could be contained passively and caution buying us time to build up an army big enough, having completely missed the firing gun before. Given that we still weren't ready when war started, I think that extra time may well have been essential. Secondly, we tend to overlook a massive feature of the eastern front in wwi - cryptography. Very soon, the Germans could read Russian transmissions faster than the Russians themselves.

Aside from the incalculable strategic gains from this, this information advantage was key in several major battles. It's not impossible that Germany could have repeated it, but the loss of the cryptographic advantage would be a big, perhaps fatal, change between the two wars. And I suspect Stalin's russia was more stable politically than the Tsar's had been - though it's eay to say that in hindsight.

There is a very nice article by Eric Margolis an excellent journalist from the United States this week that touches on the 70th anniversary as well and delves into the controversial topic of whether or not Nazi Germany saved the rest of Europe from Stalin. In the article he mentions the book The Chief Culprit by Viktor Suvorov, a former Soviet intelligence agent, who contends that Stalin was massing his entire army to march on all of Europe in Hitler apparently seeing this launched a preemptive attack Operation Barbarossa and the rest is history.

After the war the Soviets then launched a massive propaganda campaign to cover this up. So in a way Hitler saved Europe from an even worse threat than himself. I am going to order this book from Amazon as soon as I can as this whole topic sounds very interesting. I've never heard this theory before. The Russian-language edition was reprinted in Moscow in by Novoe vremia in a very large press run. It has since been translated into some eighteen languages and reprinted in scores of editions.

Suvorov's contention that Stalin had long sought an intraimperialist war that might be turned to Soviet advantage is similar, though much less sophisticated and well documented, to the interpretation advanced by Tucker , Robert C.

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Stalin's remark that the Red Army would be the last and, therefore, decisive participant in any future European war is sometimes quoted to support the contention that he consistently sought another world war to foster his supposed imperial goals, but the connection between this statement and the decision-making process in is tenuous, indeed.

See Stalin , J. A similar line of argument is pursued by Stolfi , R. Moscow , ; and Suvorov , , Posledniaia respublika Moscow , The text of Stalin's 19 August Politburo remarks has been published by T. Bushueva in Novyi mir , , no.

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Sontag , Raymond J. In contrast, German ambassador Friedrich von der Schulenburg in Moscow, who opposed a Russo-German war and who had previously warned the Soviets of its imminence, did not attempt to justify the attack in this way. Dokumenty vneshnei politiki, —22 iiuniia Moscow, , vol. MacKenzie and Ulam, in particular, are sharply critical of Stalin's policies.

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Miner characterizes the USSR as an expansionistic state, but in a limited and traditional way, seeking to incorporate the Baltic states and grab pieces of territory from other neighbors, but with no indication of an overarching plan for a revolutionary crusade and European-wide conquest Glantz , David M. John Erickson lends no support to the Suvorov thesis. Weinberg , Gerhard L. Prior to this, Gorodetsky had already challenged Suvorov's first article-length presentation of his thesis.

Also see Grigor'ev , S. Moscow , , 13 — Suvorov, Posledniaia respublika , Or perhaps you will defend your honor without being prompted? And the honor of your Motherland at the same time. Hamburg , Stuttgart, , 4: — Raack , R. See Raack , R.

Überfall auf die Sowjetunion

The Journal of Historical Review 16, no. Michaels ; and 17, no. Weinberg, A World at Arms , The Germans had very little, and they would not be dissuaded by those whose estimates of Soviet strength were more perceptive, primarily because the prejudices against Slavic peoples were reinforced by the euphoria of victory in the West.

Boelcke , Willi A. Goebbels, October March London , n. The details of this and subsequent strategic plans are available in Zakharov , M. These ideas had been developed by V.